What Grief Teaches About Love, Faith, And Resilience with Jena Ehlinger

Welcome! To schedule a session, visit catiaholm.com or call/text 956-249-7930.

On this episode, we explore grief as a human process, not a problem -- blending science, story, and practice with Jenna Ellinger’s hard-won wisdom. The conversation moves from survival to meaning, from pinholes of hope to the choice to live with love and loyalty.

Show Guest:

Jena earned her Bachelor of Science in Social Work from the University of Texas at Austin. There, she met and married her college sweetheart. The two made their home in Austin, Texas, where they raised their three children: Sam, Jake and Morgen. When her children were 14, 12, and 9 her husband tragically died competing in a triathlon in San Francisco.

Together, she and her children formed a team of four, relying on their faith, their community, and one another to rediscover joy after loss. That season taught Jena an essential truth: grief and loss are powerful forces, and pain needs a witness and lots of support.

That belief was tested again in 2021, when her middle child Jake, a gifted student and University of Texas Football Player, died from fentanyl poisoning after taking a counterfeit Xanax pill. The loss was devastating and shattering for all. But once again, Jena and her children chose to fight - not just to survive, but to keep searching for even the smallest signs of light: “pinholes of hope and joy.”

Hope and joy have continued to show up in unexpected and beautiful ways. Jena is now happily remarried, her oldest son, Sam, pursued his dreams and went to the NFL and is a Quarterback for The Denver Broncos, and is also happily married, and her youngest child, Morgen, just graduated from the University of Texas, like her brothers, and is working in Dallas in commercial real estate. Inspired by her journey, Jena returned to graduate school to be a Therapist, earning her Master's in Marriage and Family Therapy. She has a private practice and uses the experiences God has bestowed on her, both extraordinary highs and lows, to help others find healing. Jena is a speaker on grief, resilience, and finding hope in dark places. She is also an advocate for the fight against fentanyl. She spoke on Capitol Hill and worked to pass a Texas law that enables law enforcement to prosecute those poisoning others with fentanyl to face a murder charge.

You can connect with Jena at: Jena Ehlinger Counseling or on Instagram

Chapters

• 0:00 Welcome And Why Grief Matters
• 1:49 Science And Soul Of Grieving
• 3:09 Jenna’s Story Of Loss And Purpose
• 5:15 Defining Grief Beyond Death
• 9:15 Surrendering Control And Holding Both
• 12:05 Faith As Lifeline And Wrestling With God
• 18:30 Leaning In Without Drowning
• 21:40 Pinholes Of Hope And Joy
• 24:20 Getting Stuck, Models, And Meaning
• 29:40 Loyalty, Love, And Moving Forward
• 33:40 Waves, Rocks, And Integration
• 36:05 Practical Habits For Early Grief
• 41:10 Books, Music, And Perspective
• 44:20 Where To Find Jenna And Closing
• 45:08 Host’s Resources And Community Invitation

Transcript

Speaker 2: 0:00

Welcome to Couch Time with Cat, your safe place for real conversation and a gentle check-in. KWVH presents Couch Time with Cat.

Speaker 1: 0:10

Hi friends, and welcome to Couch Time with Cat, Mental Wellness with a Friendly Voice. I'm Cat, their best bestselling author, TEDx speaker, and endurance athlete. But most of all, I'm a wife, mama, and someone who deeply believes that people are good and healing is possible. Here in the Hill Country of Wimberley, Texas, I've built my life and practice around one purpose to make mental wellness feel accessible, compassionate, and real. This show is for those moments when life feels heavy, when you're craving clarity, or when you just need to hear. You're not alone. Each week we'll explore the terrain of mental wellness through stories, reflections, research, and tools you can bring into everyday life. Think of it as a conversation between friends, rooted in science, guided by heart, and grounded in the belief that healing does not have to feel clinical. It can feel like sitting on a couch with someone who gets it. So whether you're driving, walking, cooking, or simply catching your breath, you're welcome here. This is your space to feel seen, supported, and reminded of your own strength. I'm so glad you're here. Let's dive in. Today we're talking about grief. What it is, what can cause it, how we can approach it, and perhaps most importantly, what it can teach us. Today I'm so honored to be joined by Jenna, who, in spite of unimaginable loss, has become a guide, a speaker, a therapist, and an advocate, holding space for grief and light. In a moment, I'll bring her in, but first let's ground ourselves with a little science and soul to set the stage. Let's make the bridge between lived experience and modern insight. Because grief isn't just sadness, it's deeply embodied and deeply human. Research tells us grieving is a natural response to loss of someone or something significant. Someone close or a role, an identity, a way of being. Neuroscience has begun to explore how the brain changes while grieving. Activation and networks related to social pain, memory, identity. The body's stress response can shift dramatically after loss. We now recognize that grief can span multiple dimensions. Physical, emotional, cognitive, social loss touches how you feel, think and belong. Here's what I want you to hold. Grief is not a problem to fix, but a process to tend. It's messy, it's nonlinear, and it can teach us something big about love, impermanence, resilience, and meaning. Today I want to welcome Jenna Ellinger. She earned her Bachelor of Science and Social Work from the University of Texas at Austin. There she met and married her college sweetheart. They built a home in Austin and raised three children, Sam, Jake, and Morgan. When her children are 14, 12, and 9, her husband tragically died competing in a triathlon in San Francisco. In that moment, everything shifted. Together, she and her children formed a team of four, relying on community faith, and one another to rediscover joy after loss. That faith was tested again in 2021 when her middle child Jake, a gifted student and University of Texas football player, died from fentanyl poisoning after taking a counterfeit Xanax pill. Shattering and devastating to say the least. Not just to survive, but to keep searching for even the smallest signs of light. Pinholes of hope and joy. Today she is happily remarried. Her eldest son Sam pursued his dreams and went to the NFL as a quarterback for the Denver Broncos. Her youngest child just graduated and is working in Dallas. Inspired by her journey, Jenna returned to graduate school to become a therapist, earning her master's in marriage and family therapy. She is now in private practice and uses the experiences, extraordinary highs and deep lows, to help others find healing. She's also a speaker on grief, resilience, and hope, an advocate in the fight against fentanyl, speaking on Capitol Hill, helping change law so those poisoning others can face murder charges. Jenna, thank you so much for being here today.

Speaker 3: 5:11

Thank you for having me, Catya.

Speaker 1: 5:13

Oh my gosh, wow. Let's begin by how do you define grief in your work? Not necessarily in the dictionary, but a lived experience of grief. How do you define that?

Speaker 3: 5:28

Well, I gosh, like you said, grief can come in many forms. Um, you know, I think a lot of times people only think of grief as the death of someone that you care about or love. And while that is, you know, absolutely truth, um, it can also involve the loss of a relationship or the loss of a job and uh the loss of a dog. Um and we have to be able to take care of all of those different um ways that people grieve. A lot of times I also say that, you know, change is loss, and even good change can feel painful, you know, um, as your children grow up, um, as you become an empty nester or a child gets married. Um, that is, you know, that's beautiful. That's why we we raise our children and we dream of them finding their person and and becoming thriving adults. And yet it's a beautiful, beautiful change, and it still creates some loss because it's change. So I think we lose that in our culture a lot. That, you know, and people get confused, like, why am I sad? I should be happy. And you can't, they can't really identify what that is.

Speaker 1: 7:03

So what you're saying is a lot of times culture packages grief in something bad that happened, but sometimes grief can be present in something that we normally label as good.

Speaker 3: 7:15

Correct. Correct. It's that even good change can bring some feelings of loss and sadness. And I think that's very confusing for people. Um, because it's the times when we're it's like, wait, I should be happy. And yes, um, that is true. It is happy, and it can bring some pain and some grief. And learning how to handle, and you know, that's what I finally had to surrender to um after my husband died. Was I kept thinking one day I was gonna wake up and I was just gonna be better. It was just gonna feel better, and it wasn't gonna be so heavy and so painful, and then finally surrendering to I can carry this with me, I can still be sad and be joyful. I can still, you know, um miss their love and be thankful for their love. So it's kind of finding the ways to hold both.

Speaker 1: 8:22

When your husband passed away, what how did you survive that? You had three young children completely blindsided. In reflection, I'm sure you've been able to see, oh, I really like this one thing or these two or three things really kept me afloat.

Speaker 3: 8:45

I well, okay, before I even say that, let me say this. Um I have felt a lot of deep pain, a lot of very deep grief, and muddled my way through. Um, I don't want to sit here and pretend that I have this all figured out or that I did it perfectly and now we can tie it up in a box and with a pretty little bow. Um, so let me say that first. Um and then the I think the probably the three um biggest lifelines for me were my faith, um my friends. And and that includes, you know, close friends and extended community that I didn't even know I had or would need. And probably a close third, faith friends, and of course my children. I mean, we were, you know, we just like I said, band together and um, you know, kind of fought our way through. But I would say music and movement, musement and music and exercise were also um way up there as my lifelines.

Speaker 1: 10:05

So faith, friends, that includes your tight circle and then extended circles that you welcomed in and some forms of music and creativity. Exactly. Can you talk a little bit about faith in your life and how that how that has supported you? I know for me it's a huge, it's just a huge part of how I walk through the world. And I know everybody has their own experiences of God and faith. And I I want to hear yours. What what is your experience of it?

Speaker 3: 10:43

Yeah, absolutely. Um, so I um grew up in a Christian home. It was an important part of my growing up um in my in my family, kinda. Um, but it was more my dad was an alcoholic. And so as a young child, I feel like I really clung to God more as a father when I was scared or worried, worried. And so um that kind of started to shape my faith at a very young age. And then um, you know, we kind of go through different journeys in our faith. So before Ross died, I was, you know, working, but I was able to attend a Bible study with a wonderful group of women for I think we were together for 10 years. And we like really intensely got into the Bible and did some really hard studies. And that, you know, I remember one of the studies talked about how, you know, hard times will come, tragedy will come, that phone call will come. So one of the reasons we're doing this is we're building up our beings and our faith and our trust. So when we get that, we we have something to stand on, right? And at the time I was like, hmm, that's interesting. Um and then I I got that phone call. Um and the phone call of Yui pulled your husband from the water and he's not breathing. And so then that statement made a whole lot more sense. Wow. Um and I, you know, then that as a family of four, without, you know, my husband, my children's dad, we really leaned into our prayer, our church, um, our prayer with each other, um, heaven. Um, and then kind of continue to build on that. And then I will say I just thought, okay, um my faith is so strong. We had our hard, difficult card. You know, surely we're done. Like we're surely we're just the rest of life is nobody else is gonna die unless it's in the normal pattern of life. Um and so when Jake died, um, you know, I will say my faith was definitely shaken. I never lost it ever, an angry period um with God and really wrestled with him and struggled with him. And then the truth is, you know, at the end of the day, I as mad as I could be, I would be like, okay, dear God, please help me. You know, I'd be mad at him all day long. I'd say things looking back that I'm like, I'm so sorry I said that to you, God. Um and and I still had that deep peace inside, knowing he is what's going to get me through this. And he will give me the strength and he will bring good. And until you can get through enough processing and enough time to where you can really start to see that and feel that. Now, you know, four years, six months, and a few days later, after Jake died, I literally can say, I have no absolute no doubt that God is real and that there is heaven because it is, I'm, it's why I'm here today. It's why I am finding joy and hope and love and and enjoying life because I I couldn't do this on my own. I I just couldn't. And so, you know, I I will argue with the best of them. It's a pot in heaven, because I'm like, look, I mean, it's the only reason I'm not dead in a hospital, uh, you know, horrific addict. And again, no judgment for anybody who's you know still laying in bed.

Speaker 1: 14:59

How old was Jake when he died?

Speaker 3: 15:01

He was 20. So he was 20 and a half. He would have been 21 in December. He died May 6th.

Speaker 1: 15:08

Jenna, I'm so sorry.

Speaker 3: 15:11

Thank you. Thank you.

Speaker 1: 15:13

Wow, thank you. We missed, I know, yeah, I bet. That type of um loss is unimaginable to a lot of people, and a husband and a son. It is just I don't, I honestly don't have the words, and I can feel this like weight in my chest, even trying to find the words, because words feel so inadequate. Right, right. So I just want you to know as I'm as I'm speaking with you and asking you questions, know I'm coming from that place of reverence for that amount of pain and love and that side-by-side nature of what that's like. Right, right. Thank you. I know that. Thank you. In your experience, what have you seen people learn to lean into grief rather than run from it?

Speaker 3: 16:25

Yes, I think that um, you know, I say pain needs a witness, and no one should suffer alone. Um, I feel like pain is inevitable, but we can somewhat control our suffering. Um and I think it is a fine balance of leaning into it and running from it because just like you said, it is a emotional, uh physical, mental, social um just wham, like all it everything shifts all at one time. Um so I do think you know, you have to be careful of how much you can take and how much you can lean in. Um and so you can't, I mean, the truth is you can't run from it, like it is just there. And and it's really learning how to live with it and let it transform and evolve. So we don't want to re-evolve, we don't want to keep going backwards, but we can use it to help us evolve and transform ourselves, looking for how can I use this pain to help other people, going from the why to the how and what. And all of this takes time. Let me say that. Like this does not happen overnight. Um, but I think also that's another surrender of finally letting go of the whys um because we'll never have the answers.

Speaker 1: 18:14

Oh my gosh. Um the whys can keep you W H Y ask question marks. That can keep you just stuck in this kind of um like imagining like tires and mud, just exactly, exactly spinning and getting angry and anxious and resentful, and but you stay stuck.

Speaker 3: 18:40

Exactly. And I I heard this and I thought it was what a really great quote. It was um, stop trying to make sense of something that will never make sense so that you don't lose your sense. And I was like, okay, that is so true. Because we can drive ourselves crazy in in all kinds of whys. It doesn't have to be death. I mean, the whys of of the relationship ending or the divorce, you know, or or the job loss, you know, those all those all can take you down. And I do think the whys are part of the process too. Like I'm not saying you you have to you have to go through it and you have to ask them in order to get to the what and the how and make that that shift. But I do think um I called it uh pinholes of searching for pinholes of hope and joy.

Speaker 1: 19:39

Yeah, tell us about that. What is what are pinholes of hope and joy?

Speaker 3: 19:44

Well, I think when um when your world breaks like that, and I'm gonna use my own experience that hopefully others can relate to and their own, you know, grief and loss, whether it's death or something else, but I think when when Ross died, you know, the world just kind of got dark and um and it was and everything looked different and everything felt different. And so I kept like trying to find hope and joy. I knew it was there. I wanted to find it. And then you'd get little tiny, you know, pinholes that would show up, and maybe it was just a hug from a friend, or maybe it was somebody just sat with you and cried with you for an hour, or it was a walk and you found yourself laughing with somebody and you know you forgot for maybe a minute or two minutes. And so the pinholes start showing up, um, you know, either through friendships or through um, you know, something beautiful in nature that reminds you of your person. And you're like, okay, God, was that a gift? Was that are you reminding me that they're that they're with you and they're good? Um and then those pinholes with time and healing start to get bigger and bigger and bigger, and they're no longer pinholes. And then you look out and you're like, oh, wow, the sky is beautiful. It's so pretty and blue, and the leaves are gorgeous, and the flowers are so pretty, and that kind of like the sparkle of life starts to come back.

Speaker 1: 21:29

What if somebody feels stuck in their grieving and they think I should be done grieving by now? Like, why is this taking so long? I know there are different models of grief, and listener, what a model of grief is, is somebody who is in the mental health profession and they create usually with a pretty good visual what it feels like to grieve. So there's um Elizabeth Kubler Ross, there's I think it's Tonkins model, there's a dual process grief model. So there are different models, and basically what these mental health professionals are trying to do, they're trying to put an image and language to what some people feel, and not that every model is gonna get it exact for every person, but it I find for somebody who's grieving, it gives them something to touch, something to maybe kind of identify with. Earlier you said pain needs a witness, and those models are kind of like a witness, like a even if it's in a textbook or an image on the internet, it says, Hey, listen, other people experience gr have experienced grief like this. Perhaps you are also experiencing grief like this, but often grief feels we are those mud, those tires in the mud, or we are feeling extra dark, and the pinholes are harder to find. How what would you say to somebody who feels like man, everything is so dark, but also they think I should be done with this by now. Like it's been six months. What is what is the hold up here?

Speaker 3: 23:34

So, so I have I have a few thoughts on that. First of all, I think our culture is we don't do grief or death well. Um, and we're scared we're we're scared of it. Um, so I think those wonderful people who have done all of this research on grief and give us these nice little charts are are so helpful also because they help you not feel crazy because grief can make you feel like, oh my gosh, I'm I I'm losing it. Like where did I go? Why do I feel this way? Why does the smallest task seem overwhelming? Why am I, you know, walking through the grocery store and feeling pretty good? And then the next second I see the cinnamon pop tarts and I want to fall on my knees and wail like a baby because I can't buy cinnamon pop-tarts anymore because Jake's not here to eat them. So it can make you really feel like, oh my gosh, what is happening? I can't control my emotions or feelings anymore. And that can be scary. And also if you're, you know, typically wired as a pretty happy person, um, or not even necessarily, you know, or just it's hard to kind of get you down or blue or dark, and then you're feeling blue and dark a lot, you know, that can also be very scary. Like I've I've never felt like this before. So I think those, I think those are very, very helpful. Um I think we're can do a better job of talking about grief, talking about death, talking about dead people. And I think that one of the reasons that people get stuck is that we're really not very good at it. And it because we for we want to force people to move on because it makes us uncomfortable. And so if we can if we can stop pushing people to like move on or not talk about their person or you gotta let go, and you don't really move on. I mean, you don't you can't how do you move on from you know, somebody that you were married to and loved and had three babies with? How do you move on from your child? Like you don't move on.

Speaker: 25:50

No, there is no moving on.

Speaker 3: 25:52

No, you move forward, and like I said, you learn to carry it. And I think one of the things that I would say is in in the feeling stuck, I think we also tend to, we can get stuck because we feel like we confuse our loyalty to them and our love to them with not moving on. So we think, whoa, if I move forward and I get a new, I'm I fall in love again, or I move forward and I'm living life and I am joyful and I'm dancing again and I am having fun, then oh, I can't do that because then that means I'm not sad anymore. And then I've left my person behind. So I have to stay sad and I have to stay kind of stuck in the darkness in order to stay loyal to them. And that is the farthest thing from the truth because their love will always be bigger than their death. Death cannot take their love away. Their love is not going anywhere, their love will never go anywhere. And I believe that loyalty to them is moving forward with even more love, moving forward with more appreciation for life, moving forward with more appreciation from every hug you get from the people you care about and you love. I mean, I think sometimes people kind of think I'm crazy now because when I hug them, I I squeeze really tight. I'm not doing it. I mean, it's not like this thing where I'm like, well, I'm gonna hug really tight now. It's just like there's an appreciation and a and a perspective that's a beautiful thing. And that's because of them. And I, you know, feel like being loyal to them is loving like them, and they love big, really big. So I'm like, I want to love like that. I want to spread more joy. They make people laugh. I'm not really funny, but if I sometimes I'm funny by accident, if I can make somebody laugh, that's amazing. And so little things like that where I can find ways to honor them and carry them forward and also talk about them. Because sadly, I think that the job of making people more comfortable actually falls on the person who's grieving to talk about them to make it more comfortable because people are so uncomfortable. But the more I say Ross's name, the more I say Jake's name, the more everyone around me feels like, oh, okay, well, I can tell that story I just thought of, or I can tell whatever I remembered, or I can send the picture I just found. And it makes everybody be able to continue to carry forward. And the last thing I will say about being stuck is I I do believe you can get unstuck, and part of that is a choice. There is a big choice, and the choice is am I going to die with my person who died? Or am I going to continue to live and love like I believe they would want me to, like I know God wants me to? So it is a choice. And I'm not saying it's an easy choice, and I'm not saying I don't still have to make it some days. But I do think at some point you have to say, I know I'm gonna die. We're all gonna die. Um, am I gonna let myself die with them before I'm actually dead and not live this beautiful life that I have, you know, and look at what I do have. My goodness gracious, I have two beautiful, healthy children still alive and kicking. One's married and I love his wife more than anything, and I have a wonderful husband who adores me. So I can I can choose to not focus on that and focus on how much I miss Ross and Jake and how if I just sit in that missing and missing and missing, missing, and that's all I think about, well then yeah, I'm stuck again. I'm I am back in the mud. So I do think there's a choice in that. Um, I will make a plug for the book called The Choice. Yeah. And by Edith Eager. Yeah, she's I happen to read that. Yes, I happened to read that after Jake died. Um I read every I've read every book on heaven. Um, I love all of them. I've read, you know, all the books on um a lot of the near-death experience um books by John Burke. Love him, love his his research, um, brings a lot of comfort um to what our people are experiencing in heaven, which gives me so much peace. And for my kids and I to know, like we know where we're going, we know we're gonna be with them. So that also helps back to the faith piece of my lifelines. That also helps us not stay stuck. Because we know we're going there and we know they're gonna be there, and we know we're gonna be with them forever. So again, do we choose to enjoy this short time we have on this earth or do we and do our best to do that? Not perfect, I'm not saying that, um, but do our best, or do we choose to let the death be bigger than the love?

Speaker 1: 31:52

You said so many profound things. Thank you for thank you for that. Something in terms of how do we make other people more comfortable? Sometimes it feels like if we are enjoying, sometimes we are afraid people will judge us, and it will look like we are not actually hurting. I as of this recording, I told you before we started um this podcast that yesterday I gave the eulogy for a friend and mentor for 25 years, and the time between his death and his celebration of life was long. It was um three weeks. So I really grieved in terms of crying and sadness and feeling really just heartbroken for two weeks. And then I wrote, I'm a writer. So I wrote something and I wrote a tribute to him and I shared it publicly, and that really helped me process. And then a few days before his celebration of life, his family asked me if I would eulogize him, and I thought, amazing, yes, I'm so humbled. So I did that, and then the day before his funeral, I found out I was only one of two people eulogizing him. So it wasn't like I wasn't like a tiny part of the service, I was a full part of the service. So I thought, Right, okay, so something in me like got very sturdy the day before the celebration of life, and the yesterday at a celebration of life, I was very, very sturdy, I was full of love, and just because I'm a therapist, I also hold people's pain really well, and so I was witness to all these people's pain and holding them as they were grieving, and I thought, I feel fantastic, and I mean it was so bizarre, I felt so good, and then I found myself telling people I already cried a lot, like I wanted to explain. I was kind of giving, I didn't want them to think I wasn't hurting, so that was interesting. I found myself rationalizing my my countenance, and then today I am down in the dumps again, like it all it's like the floor came out from under me. I don't want to talk to anybody. I'm like just I do want to talk to you, Jenna. But in general, I'm just not, I am not who today who I was yesterday. And so as I'm listening to you speak, I'm thinking, oh man, I've got this pounding headache. Like grief, grief just stayed at the door for me the last 48 hours, and it it somehow knew like this lady's got to do things, so let's just give her a break for 48 hours.

Speaker 2: 35:17

So true.

Speaker 1: 35:18

And then it's like, okay, dear, your time's up. Like and it just came back in today, which was so it was so surprising. And I I joke, this is my first death without Zoloft. So I am really feeling it. It's interesting. Yes, it's interesting the the way it's morphing.

Speaker 3: 35:43

I I like to call it um uh when grief first hits, um, it's like a tsunami, and you are just doing your best to stay above water with your little chin up there, just taking a breath and just peddling, I mean, paddling and kicking like crazy underneath the water. And then the tsunami wave starts to settle, it gets a little bit better, your head's a little bit higher, you got a little float under you, you're feeling really good, you're rocking along, and then all of a sudden, boom, and that wave hits again. You're like, oh no, I'm back down again, and you're peddling, you know, paddling along, paddling, paddling. But I do think with time, as it transforms, and just like you said, our neurons adjust. There is definitely a brain component of this, of what happens to our brains with deep loss, and our brains start to be able to adapt, the waves get farther apart and they get smaller. And we also, I think, learn how to dog paddle and swim better with them. Um, I like to tell people who are, you know, in the early days of grief, early months, that they need to treat their cells like they just got out of ICU. Because when we get out of ICU, we are very good to ourselves. We are resting, we are drinking water, we are letting people help us. We are taking really good care of ourselves and we're not pushing ourselves. And that is what we need to do when we're in grief, because that is what our bodies and our minds and our hearts are going through. And so I think remembering like, let people help you, let your friends love on you, um, and and then take as good a care of yourself as you possibly can is so important. Um and then the only other thing that I was gonna say that that came to me was when you were talking about how you felt really strong and peaceful yesterday, and then today you're like, ugh, I just I can barely deal. Is I I heard this one time and I wish I could credit who I heard it from, but I can't remember. But it was they compared grief to like you have a rock, a big rock, and you put it in a in a in a jar, and it kind of takes up most of the jar, like you barely get it in there. So the rock is grief, the jar is you and it's barely fitting, it's really big in there. The rock never changes size, it stays exactly the same way, but the jar, you, your being, your soul grows bigger and bigger and bigger around it so that it can carry it in a much more healthy, loving, honoring way, and it's not taking you over or hijacking you from being able to enjoy all that all of life that there still is.

Speaker 1: 39:03

That's beautiful. We grow, and that is our ability to integrate it into our lives.

Speaker 2: 39:11

Yes. Would you say so? Perfect word, perfect word, yes, that's exactly right.

Speaker 1: 39:15

So you said in the immediacy of grief, we should treat ourselves well and gently. Are there any other kind of practical habits or rituals that you rec recommend for people navigating grief, let's say, right at the outset? Do you recommend light movement or journaling or spending time with the memory of the person?

Speaker 3: 39:40

Yes. Um, I would say, well, first of all, I definitely in the early days, limiting your time alone, um, making sure you're around very safe people that feel very safe and loving, where you can just be how you are. Like you're not worried about if you're on the floor. Crying, that's okay. Um, if you're chatting like nothing's ever happened, that's okay. Um and I would say also um journaling, I like to write my prayers when when I couldn't find the pinholes of hope and joy. It was hard for me to read my Bible, it was hard for me to say prayers, um, but it was easier when I wrote them. And I do think that some research shows that writing um also helps our brains um heal, especially in the morning when our neurons are neurons are all fresh.

Speaker 1: 40:35

Okay, I didn't know the morning part.

Speaker 3: 40:37

And yeah, um, again, I I just I mean, I couldn't get enough of books about heaven and eternity. Um, that brought me a lot of comfort. Um definitely moved some of the pain and move some of the grief out of our bodies and it's forward motion, just like a meditation. Um, I think that that's extremely important. I think being very cognizant of what you're feeding your mind, um, what you're listening to, who you're talking to, who you're surrounding yourself with, you know, in my darkest moments when I couldn't get myself off of the floor and I couldn't find the light, um, having, you know, whether it be um my now husband or or very dear friends or I mean, even my children, um, you know, I try not to bring them my grief because they're experiencing their own deep grief. So you have to do that dance too. Um just reminding me, you know, where my people are and that they are in heaven and that they are more joyful than we can imagine, and that they want us to be joyful and happy. I think some people, some therapists believe that that's too much pressure for people to say, well, how would they, what would they say to you? What would they want you to do? How would they want you to handle this moving forward? And I see where that can be like, oh, that's like too much pressure. I'm in pain right now. I agree with that. And I think at a certain point, it's also very helpful because once you can get to that place of healing, I do think it can be very healing and um transformative to think to yourself, what would Jake say to me right now? That probably one of the most joyful people ever put on this planet. Um, what would Ross say to me right now? It was a love spreader, love giver. So um I think all of those things, music, as I said earlier, was huge for me. I actually have my music therapy list that I hand to clients who are grieving. Yes. Um, yeah, a lot of it's Christian music. Um, because for me, that's what resonates to me is is I call it my Jesus music. Um and it gave me words when I had no words, and it gave me peace and soothing and comfort when I when I couldn't find it myself. So I think music can be very, very impactful. Um and again, reading Man Search for Meaning, uh Victor Frankel, The Choice, Edith Eager can be very helpful with perspectives. Um and then, you know, why do bad things happen to good people? Um, all of the the a grief observed by C.S. Lewis is super powerful. Uh the Imagine Heaven books were super powerful. So again, I'm saying all this is what worked for me.

Speaker 1: 43:53

Jenna, thank you so much for sharing your story and your wisdom with us. I think that every listener who listens, and there's thousands of them, will be comforted and will find a lot of inspiration in your story and also in the way that you have walked through and and really fortified yourself in a way that you can help others walk through also. If listeners want to work with you or reach out to you, where can they find you?

Speaker 3: 44:21

Yes. So my email is J Ellinger, which is a mouthful. J E H L I N G E R at Gmail.com. And my website is just jelllingercounseling.com. And again, that's J E H L I N G E R Counseling.com.

Speaker 1: 44:42

Great. And I'll put that all in the show notes so listeners will be able to find you.

Speaker 3: 44:46

Thank you.

Speaker 1: 44:47

Listeners, thank you. Thank you so much for listening to this episode of Couch Time with Cat. Take care of yourselves and we'll see you next time. Thank you for spending this time with me. If something from today's conversation resonated, or if you're in a season where support would help, visit me at gattyahollam.com. That's C-A-T-I-A-H-O-L-M.com. You can also leave an anonymous question for the show by calling or texting 956-249-7930. I'd love to hear what's on your heart. If Couch Time with Cat has been meaningful to you, it would mean so much if you'd subscribe, rate, and leave a review. It helps others find us and it grows this community of care. And if you know someone who needs a little light right now, send them this episode. Remind them they're not alone. Until next time, be gentle with yourself. Keep showing up and know I'm right here with you.